Thank you! It's probably easiest to stay with the same system, yes, but somehow it's very tempting to try something different! I haven't shot with anything else, so I don't know what I'm missing (if indeed anything).

Street_Photography wrote:Joel_O wrote:...What I'm really wondering is how much better the AF is in the newer Fuji bodies compared with my X-E1? ...Its light years ahead of the XE1. Especially with the older Fuji lenses in SAF. I would guess 50 times faster. Seriously, the difference is huge.OK, thank you. That is very good to hear. But how do you shoot fast-moving targets? I do you trust the continuous tracking AF more than your ability to (pre) focus a single spot?

Pan50 wrote:It is a myth you can’t print large with 16mp. Any of those photos in your post could easily be printed to 20x30. How big do you want? Also, there isn’t any camera that is easy to use with gloves on, although a bigger body like the XT1-XT4 line with a bettery grip will provide easier handling than an XE1-XE4. Maybe think about an XT2 with grip: is lightweight, compact, easy to use, has a flip screen and 24mp.Yeah, true, I've printed 60x100 cm with 16 Mpix, but I do prefer to stand a couple of meters away when watching them.As for the XT-bodies... I just think they are too big for my usage, even if the better ergonomics are tempting. But I'm going to try out the XT30, XE4 (with grips) and XS10! I hope one of these would fit the bill both size and ergonomic-wise.

Tim van der Leeuw wrote:Canon EOS M system: There are GREAT lenses for the EOS-M system and they are really nice and small. If size is your primary concern, it may be the system for you since those fine lenses are so nice and small.However... Having shot with the EOS-M system myself for the past two years, I feel that the system is pretty much in a dead end now. Canon doesn't seem to have a viable roadmap towards newer cameras with better sensors that have less noise. Images quickly get very noisy on my EOS-M5.If you ever want a lens longer than 200mm, then you have to step out of the EOS-M lens system into much bigger EF lenses with an adapter (unless you are OK with the manual focus only Samyang 300mm prime mirror lens).The shooting experience itself with Canon is to me not as nice and pleasant as with the Fuji bodies that I have but that's a matter of personal taste.The AF in the M6 mkii is certainly said to be very good by everyone who has that camera. But the Fuji AF in their recent bodies might be good enough for your use?So with these caveats, my personal recommendation would be not to get into EOS-M, but of course, you should make your own judgement based on the facts.And comparing cameras for size, once you start adding some lenses I think that they're all going to be pretty comparable in size, even the X-S10 with its more protruding grip -- the extra depth of the grip is likely not going to be noticeable with most lenses you'd add?Check sizes on here and add lenses to suit your shooting preferences:https://camerasize.com/compact/#829,864,869,816,ha,tHey, again. I see you replied to me here as well, thank you! It's really great to find someone who has used both systems.I also hear you when it comes to the slow and probably dragged-out death of the M system... I'm just tempted with the M6 MkII because its (supposedly) good tracking continuous AF. Most of my shots from skiing trips are from the ascent because it's frankly quite frustrating to try to hit fast downhill skiers with the XE1 (if I don't pre-focus and use a small aperture).Otherwise, I'm very tempted with the XS10. Feature-wise it sounds bang on. I think the two ergonomic questionmark I have is the shutter button (with gloves, even thin ones, more protruded screw-on shutters are helpful) and the usability of the small retracted control dials (with gloves). But this is something I can easily check just in a store. In the meantime, I'm going to make full use of that camera-size comparison tool! It's super useful to get a sense of the combined length of camera+lens!

Street_Photography wrote:I tried an XT30 for the first time today and was very impressed. Felt great in-hand, with a more rubbery grip than the XT3 which is harder and far heavier. The XT30 is only slightly heavier than an XE, but less compared to the heaviest XE (4th).The flip up screen is really quick and easy to use (unlike the newer sleek one which you have to dig out). The size difference is only a few mm and I would prefer the ease of use for the extra size (might go in multiple directions like the XT3 too, which I used a lot). That, a flash in the body and the rear and front grip make it far more attractive than the XE4 imo. The XT30 just felt right, practical, really solid. And it looks nice enough to consider the silver version.I prefer left EVF but the flip screen, weight and grip makes up for not having that. Plus the extra control dial on top should come in useful. It's really convinced me to consider central EVF cameras again after ruling them out after the XT3, which was too heavy for a long day with the 18-55mm for me.The XT3 was an enormous upgrade from the XE3. Photos had a lot more crunch and loved the extra controls, amazing EVF and JPG options. The XT30 has the same IQ as the XT3 and many similarities in a smaller lighter body. But a few people have said it's a bit small for their hands.This is very good to hear. I have never handled it but just based on the specs it looks "just right" both size and ergonomic-wise. Luckily I also have tiny hands, so at least that part won't be an issue.The A6500 might be a good option with it having IBIS. But the standard Sony lenses aren't good, so will need heavier ones like the Sigmas. I haven't looked at Canon but may have a peek now.For me, upgrading from an XE2. The front runners at the moment are the XT20/XT30 and A6400/A6500.It's a good point to look at the 6500 too. It seems similar in size to the 6400. Then I suppose it becomes a trade-off between IBIS vs. the newer (supposedly super!) real-time tracking. Ultimately, I think I just need to get my hands on some of these Sony models to know what to really think about both their ergonomics and JPG:s.

I do the same types of photography. I can only tell you what I do, not suggesting it's best, but it works for me. I use 3 setups:1) Smallest: XF10 for technical rock climbing. Absolute smallest size. In small lowepro Dashpoint 20pouch.2) Small: XE3 + XC15-45 for mountaineering. This combo is excellent despite XC's handling shortfalls. I long for an XF15-35.  Sometimes substitute a small prime (XF27/XF35 etc). In Dashpoint 30 pouch.3) Medium size: XT3 + XF16-80 or sometimes XF90 for BC skiing. I have a mindshift rotation pack that allows me to take the bigger camera. Sometimes use mindshift multi-mount 10 with chest strap. Bigger camera is better for gloves..though I usually take gloves off anyway.I would offer a 3rd suggestion - the XE3. Smallest size, AF is certainly good enough for general use. It should be good enough for skiing with a newer fast AF lens. I use the XE3 + 16F2.8/23F3 for mountain biking action photography and it works ok.XT30 is a good option, but i prefer reduced snag points + smaller pouch with XE3. IMHO fuji made a mistake with XE4. It really is not smaller than XE3. Shame.BTW I don't use a waterproof bag for the camera. I use the smallest lightly padded fast-access pouch I can find. Speed of access is key to me to get the moment. Small pouch can fit under Goretex jacket.

Morris0 wrote:You take lovely images and changing cameras will not change this. For print size the most important factors are image quality which is a result of photographer skill, then lens and last camera body. A newer body can print a bit larger though not as much as one would expect.Operating any camera in the cold with gloves is tough. If conditions don't allow taking gloves off for a moment to take a photo, then a good pare of photographers gloves makes a huge difference though there not as warm as quality mittens. You could ware photographers gloves under mittens or thin liners under either. I'm glad spring is hear as it's so much easier not to have to deal with gloves.MorrisThank you very much, Morris. It's a good point not to underestimate the lens quality for printing. I think I might have gotten used to the excellent optics in the 18-55/2.8-4.0 Fuji lens and forget that not all similarly compact lenses from Sony and Canon necessarily have the same quality.The cold is certainly uncomfortable, but I always wear thinner gloves or liners under my mittens. Even so, I find that the operation is always a bit of a hassle between getting the shot in time vs the settings you actually want. I'm going to have a look at these dedicated photographer gloves thou. Sounds like a worthwhile investment.Best of springtime to you as well! Certainly looking forward to it myself.Joel

That would be the least amount of hassle that probably won't go wrong! Just need to check that it fits in my bag. I'm happy to switch cameras and brands. But I won't switch my trusted waterproof bag. We all gotta draw the line somewhere.

Your photos are very nice

rattrr75 wrote:I’m going to vote X-S10. I think in these scenarios you will appreciate the security of the grip. The body itself is tiny. And the fact that you can save not just IQ settings but AF and exposure settings on C1-C4 means that perhaps you will find useful the ability to switch more settings with just one knob twist than is possible on the other bodies. IBIS, for sure. And the ability to face the LCD inward during transport for protection.I’d recommend the X-T4 even more (for weather sealing, battery life and better EVF) but it sounds like it might be too big. And you’d not get the same great hold on it that you can the X-S10.Edit: one more reason for X-S10 - the ability to record video clips quickly with the Record button without touching a single other knob or switchThank you! I did not think about those C1-C4 buttons on the XS10. That is exactly the kind of "rough-and-rapid" customizability that I need. I like to have a set-up where 30s is enough to stop, make sure I or my gear don't fall off the mountain, pull out the camera, make some quick adjustments, take a number of shots, get the camera back in the bag and get moving again.The better EVF, bigger battery and weather sealing of the XT4 is certainly tempting, but the body would require a bigger bag that probably would restrict my movement more and make the rest of the trip less enjoyable. At least with small batteries, you make sure to have a couple of spares tucked in somewhere next to your body where they stay warm and charged.

Clive99 wrote:I do the same types of photography. I can only tell you what I do, not suggesting it's best, but it works for me. I use 3 setups:1) Smallest: XF10 for technical rock climbing. Absolute smallest size. In small lowepro Dashpoint 20pouch.2) Small: XE3 + XC15-45 for mountaineering. This combo is excellent despite XC's handling shortfalls. I long for an XF15-35. Sometimes substitute a small prime (XF27/XF35 etc). In Dashpoint 30 pouch.3) Medium size: XT3 + XF16-80 or sometimes XF90 for BC skiing. I have a mindshift rotation pack that allows me to take the bigger camera. Sometimes use mindshift multi-mount 10 with chest strap. Bigger camera is better for gloves..though I usually take gloves off anyway.I would offer a 3rd suggestion - the XE3. Smallest size, AF is certainly good enough for general use. It should be good enough for skiing with a newer fast AF lens. I use the XE3 + 16F2.8/23F3 for mountain biking action photography and it works ok.XT30 is a good option, but i prefer reduced snag points + smaller pouch with XE3. IMHO fuji made a mistake with XE4. It really is not smaller than XE3. Shame.BTW I don't use a waterproof bag for the camera. I use the smallest lightly padded fast-access pouch I can find. Speed of access is key to me to get the moment. Small pouch can fit under Goretex jacket.Thanks, man! This is super helpful. "Speed of access is key", couldn't agree with you more. It's not just the camera, but the ease and speed of the process from realizing you want to take a picture to a correctly focused and exposed shot stored on your memory card.As you've probably gathered, the main reason for me to consider other brands is the AF, so it's very good to hear you manage those MB shots with the XE3. You're happy with the XT3 for BC skiing as well then, I assume?I also have "three" setups, except I've done it with one camera so far.1) Technical climbs: XE1 and the XF27 pancake. Goes into an Osrpay ultralight S camera bag and stays out of the way until I need it.2) General mountaineering: XE1 and the 18-55 kit lens in the Ortlieber bag. I like having it separate and under my backpack, with a waist strap in addition to the shoulder strap. But I would like a wider angle, so have been considering the 14/2.8 prime.3) BC skiing: XE1 and the 50-230 in the Ortlieber bag.Being in a different financial situation now than 10 years ago, I could of course consider multiple cameras. Have been thinking of the Ricoh GR before, but didn't even know Fuji makes the XF10. So, thanks for that tip too.I'm not particularly worried about my gear (they are meant to be abused), but the Ortlieb bag is a real peach (that happens to be waterproof as well. It's just the waterproof fabric, some padding, no unnecessary compartments, and a sliding lock that opens much quicker than a zipper (and doesn't freeze). It's discontinued thou, so I want to part from it much less than my camera.I think I just need to go and handle these newer Fuji bodies to figure out those compromises between size, sag points, grip (or lack therof) etc.

You have some fantastic photos in your post and it sounds like AF speed is one of your primary concerns. Fuji's AF capabilities have improved dramatically since the launch of the X-E1. Not just small incremental improvements, but massive orders of magnitude improvements. All of the 16mp bodies are basically unusable for fast action. The 24mp bodies (X-E3, X-T2, X-T20, etc.) saw a massive jump in AF performance and were very usable for fast action. The newer 26mp bodies (X-E4, X-T30, X-S10, X-T3, etc) are even better. It is really tough to put into words just how dramatic the AF differences are between the older bodies and newer bodies.I have been using the X-T2 to successfully shoot downhill ski racing for a number of years. My keeper rate was easily over 90% and this is with subjects moving over 30mph/50kph and often in situation where they appear suddenly over a knoll. I recently upgraded to the X-T3 and my keeper rate was over 95% at the last ski race of the season. This was about 450 photos with less than 10 that weren't in focus. I shoot bursts with C-AF using a fixed single focus point.  I will pre-focus on the upper gate closest to where I am expecting the racer to appear, but this is more to help me see the racer in the viewfinder than any need to assist the AF system.  Any of the modern Fuji bodies would have absolutely zero problem providing rapid and reliable AF in the situations depicted in your sample images and would be largely similar to Sony and Canon AF capabilities in these same situations.As for lenses, Sony and Canon have nothing remotely comparable to your XF 18-55mm f/2.8-4.0.  Canon only has two standard zooms for the EF-M system and they are both optically inferior to your XF 18-55mm.  Sony's compact standard zooms are even worse and the good lenses are much bigger.  Trying to remain compact with the A7C would mean relying almost exclusively on prime lenses and would be next to impossible in the telephoto range. Your X-E1 with 50-230mm weigh 725 grams total.  The A7C with the Tamron 70-300mm weighs a total of 1054 grams and is physically much larger too.  Sony's own 70-300mm is an additional 309 grams heavier.There have been a lot of rumors lately that Canon will be discontinuing the M system and focusing solely on the R system.  R lenses can not be adapted the the M system and M lenses can not be adapted to the R system.  Even if it is not discontinued, the M system has been largely neglected. Canon launched the M system in 2012 (the same year Fuji launched the X mount) and have only introduced 8 lenses with one of them (EF-M 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6) already discontinued. If you switched to the Canon M6 II, make absolutely sure everything you would ever want from the system is available right now as future updates are extremely unlikely.

Just to chip in I had my X-E3 and 23/2 out hanging round my neck for a couple of hours at -30C and on another day for four hours at -20C and it performed well throughout.  XC skiing Arctic Finland Feb 2020.

I traded my Sony A7Rii in to switch to Fuji, mostly because:1). I was ALWAYS spending time editing that I didn't want to spend to get the colors I wanted2). Ergonomics - it was fiddly and not intuitive. I'm not convinced I've found Fuji to be radically better, here, but I'm new enough to it that I am withholding judgment. Some things are easier, if maybe not faster. Access to the shutter dial, aperture rings on the lens and ISO dial when using a tripod, in the cold, though, are awesome. A clear win for me.3). Many good lenses for Sony FF are HUGE. No fun to haul around in the mountains.I regularly use, and like, a Sony a6300 and had an a6000. I didn't stay with those mostly because of reasons 1 and 2 above (2 for a different reason - see below). But the size and AF on the Sony APS-C cameras are outstanding for outdoor sports. The tracking is completely reliable. Completely. Lock on target, fire away and the VAST majority of your shots will be spot on at 11fps. It's REALLY impressive. If I was only, or even mostly shooting outdoor sports, I would have gone that way. An A6400 with the new Tamron 17-70 f2.8 gives you an excellent zoom range, great optics that are stabilized, light weight and weather sealing. The colors on the newer gen Sonys are better than they were. They still are not Fuji. I would take a hard look at that option, though. There are some great tiny primes for that series - the Sigma 16mm f1.4 is fantastic (not tiny), the Samyang primes are small and quite good.Easy to use with gloves? Not if you have to change literally ANYTHING other than what's programmed to the wheel. If you shoot in aperture or shutter priority mostly and stick with lock-on continuous AF, then you don't really have to change much. If you shoot manual everything and like to vary up modes - nope. Not with gloves on. Everything on those bodies is tiny. But when I shoot skiers with them, it's easy. Shutter or aperture priority puts the big wheel in charge, AF target box in the center so I just point it at my skier, lock it on and fire away.Just be ready to edit more.The X-E4 would be tempting, but the lack of weather sealing worries me (but maybe I'm overblowing that issue?). If you have done fine with your X-E1 though, with both weather and use in the field, it seems like the X-E4 would give you a lot of more than you have now, with no new downsides. And you already have the glass.......

Joel_O wrote:Clive99 wrote:I do the same types of photography. I can only tell you what I do, not suggesting it's best, but it works for me. I use 3 setups:1) Smallest: XF10 for technical rock climbing. Absolute smallest size. In small lowepro Dashpoint 20pouch.2) Small: XE3 + XC15-45 for mountaineering. This combo is excellent despite XC's handling shortfalls. I long for an XF15-35. Sometimes substitute a small prime (XF27/XF35 etc). In Dashpoint 30 pouch.3) Medium size: XT3 + XF16-80 or sometimes XF90 for BC skiing. I have a mindshift rotation pack that allows me to take the bigger camera. Sometimes use mindshift multi-mount 10 with chest strap. Bigger camera is better for gloves..though I usually take gloves off anyway.I would offer a 3rd suggestion - the XE3. Smallest size, AF is certainly good enough for general use. It should be good enough for skiing with a newer fast AF lens. I use the XE3 + 16F2.8/23F3 for mountain biking action photography and it works ok.XT30 is a good option, but i prefer reduced snag points + smaller pouch with XE3. IMHO fuji made a mistake with XE4. It really is not smaller than XE3. Shame.BTW I don't use a waterproof bag for the camera. I use the smallest lightly padded fast-access pouch I can find. Speed of access is key to me to get the moment. Small pouch can fit under Goretex jacket.Thanks, man! This is super helpful. "Speed of access is key", couldn't agree with you more. It's not just the camera, but the ease and speed of the process from realizing you want to take a picture to a correctly focused and exposed shot stored on your memory card.As you've probably gathered, the main reason for me to consider other brands is the AF, so it's very good to hear you manage those MB shots with the XE3. You're happy with the XT3 for BC skiing as well then, I assume?I also have "three" setups, except I've done it with one camera so far.1) Technical climbs: XE1 and the XF27 pancake. Goes into an Osrpay ultralight S camera bag and stays out of the way until I need it.2) General mountaineering: XE1 and the 18-55 kit lens in the Ortlieber bag. I like having it separate and under my backpack, with a waist strap in addition to the shoulder strap. But I would like a wider angle, so have been considering the 14/2.8 prime.I occasionally substituted in the 14/2.8 before I got my 15-45. The semi-extreme wide angle makes for some really unique shots in the mountains. I would strongly suggest the XC15-45. It's super sharp at 15 and much smaller than 18-55. I got mine used really cheap (i think about $200CAD. XF14 is pricy).3) BC skiing: XE1 and the 50-230 in the Ortlieber bag.From what i've heard, the XE1 is slow to focus. You would find the XE3 a big step up in AF speed. I like the rangefinder style for this application because it fits in the smallest pouch. You need to size pouch for viewfinder hump with the SLR style bodies.Being in a different financial situation now than 10 years ago, I could of course consider multiple cameras. Have been thinking of the Ricoh GR before, but didn't even know Fuji makes the XF10. So, thanks for that tip too.Focus isn't great, but mostly acceptable if the subject is not moving. IQ is stellar.I'm not particularly worried about my gear (they are meant to be abused), but the Ortlieb bag is a real peach (that happens to be waterproof as well. It's just the waterproof fabric, some padding, no unnecessary compartments, and a sliding lock that opens much quicker than a zipper (and doesn't freeze). It's discontinued thou, so I want to part from it much less than my camera.Hmm curious about that. As much as I like zippers for protection, they can be slow.I think I just need to go and handle these newer Fuji bodies to figure out those compromises between size, sag points, grip (or lack therof) etc.Yes. I may take a look at the XE4, but even if can get around the lack of a grip, losing the AF selector lever is a deal killer. I use that a lot in the mountains - switching between action and landscape.

Which Ortlieb bag is that in your picture? It’s exactly what I’m looking for!

Clive99 wrote:I do the same types of photography. I can only tell you what I do, not suggesting it's best, but it works for me. I use 3 setups:2) Small: XE3 + XC15-45 for mountaineering. This combo is excellent despite XC's handling shortfalls. I long for an XF15-35. Sometimes substitute a small prime (XF27/XF35 etc). In Dashpoint 30 pouch.This is my ultra light set up, I can't go without an EVF...Had it once, tried other configurations, ended up getting again...This is my bagless combo.The lens is fiddly ...but the IQ is quality, esp 15-30... esp at 15...it tested better than the 16 2.8 in MTF chart ...For more serious stuff when i don't care about weight, I currently use X-T1 with 14 2.8, 23 f2, 35 1.4, 56 1.2 in tow. Or maybe a 2 body combo with 27 on the XE3 and the 14 on the X-T1. I can fit either combination in a Think Tank Mirrorless Mover 10 bag. Will upgrade body at some point.

Joel_O wrote:Street_Photography wrote:Joel_O wrote:...What I'm really wondering is how much better the AF is in the newer Fuji bodies compared with my X-E1? ...Its light years ahead of the XE1. Especially with the older Fuji lenses in SAF. I would guess 50 times faster. Seriously, the difference is huge.OK, thank you. That is very good to hear. But how do you shoot fast-moving targets? I do you trust the continuous tracking AF more than your ability to (pre) focus a single spot?Doesn't work well with the XE2, especially with old lenses like the 27mm f2.8. It is better with zooms and f2 lenses but is probably no better than using SAF and focusing just in front of your subject. I did some panning shots of bikes today with CAF and the 23mm f2 at 1/30 shutter speed. The number of shots in focus was terribly low.I think tomorrow I will use SAF and focus on the front of the bike so the rider could be in focus- rely on the 23 being faster to lock on and do a very quick pan. I wouldn't dream of using CAF with the 27mm lens. With that one I may focus on the road first then pan and click when the subject hits that spot, but that's not always suitable if they move outside the focus plane.Apparently the XE4 and XS10 (maybe one or two more like the XT4) have advanced CAF algorithms which may or may not be given to other Xtrans 4 cameras like the X Pro 3, XT3 and XT30 in future. Basically if CAF is important buy as new as you can afford. I don't pan often and always get a few keepers, so will be happy with the little improvement from Xtrans 2 to Xtrans 3.If CAF is really important then Sony is the way to go. It would be great to have their animal eye tracking. Fujifilm has lots of slow lenses which are bad at CAF, even on new cameras. Which is a reason why people often request updated versions of them.DPReview has videos comparing Sony focusing to Fuji. They made one recently and said Sony is way ahead of the latest Fuji cameras fir CAF (the A6400 has been out quite a while). Here is one example but there are more including the XT4 Vs a Sony:

Geekapoo wrote:And-roid wrote:Geekapoo wrote:Great pics. I'd go with the XT30 to take advantage of the better AF (vs the X-E1) with your current lenses. Would steer clear of the X-E4 and the X-S10 as I think both cameras somewhat deficient with respect to ergonomics and at least for me, would be a horror show if wearing gloves.Lol, X-S10 has the best ergonomics of any camera imo currently available👍Or do you know something I don't, unlikely!What exactly would be horror show?The joystick's are simplicity itselfThe ev dial is not too stiff, not too looseThei incredible gripThe full support for manual shooting with front dial and rear dial and the lens ringThe 4 fully programmed pre-set settings on the twist of a dial.There is probably no other camera that is as easy and adaptable as the x-s10 with or without gloves!I owned the X-S10 for a few days and really disliked the camera. Yes, the IBIS was wonderful as was the grip. Thought I'd be ok with PASM..and I was. What I really disliked was the loss of the D pad, loss of MSC switch, drop in EVF quality (vs XT3) and ncreased reliance on the tiny joystick.Same joystick as x-t3 isn't it?Better bbf placement than x-t3/4?The msc switch is horrible to useObviously, camera ergo/UI is a very personal thing. Having owned an XPRO1, XPRO2, XT20 and the XT3 (which I love), I have a good frame of reference with respect to Fuji APS-C cameras. Wonderful to hear that you think the X-S10 has the best ergonomics..this is why Fuji has so many body styles. Personally, I think the X-S10 ergonomics is pretty poor to the point that I would not shoot with the camera even if given to me for free. JMHO. Both of our opinions about the X-S10 are quite valid. Cheers.agreed,

Great pictures! I have much empathy with you while facing that problem. Camera designers are not all alpinists, hikers, sailors or canoe expedition amateurs apparently.I have no issues operating my X-El with gloves on in winter. The XT3 is not bad either but is larger. A feature I love on the X-T3 is the AF-C wide tracking and I use it to compose portraits embedded in scenery; point to the subject, press, frame and take the picture. All xtrans-4 cameras have that mode. I would go to the camera store with my gloves and see if I can operate the X_E4 or the X-T30 with the gloves on.